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HomeMy WebLinkAbout08-06-1996 Public Hearing PUBLIC HEARING COMMISSION-COUNCIL CHAMBERS August 6, 1996 PRESENT: Hons. Mayor Pro Tem Handy, Beard, Bridges, H. Brigham, J. Brigham, Kuhlke, Mays, Powell, Todd and Zetterberg, member of Augusta-Richmond County Commission-Council. Also present were Lena Bonner, Clerk of Commission-Council; James B. Wall, Augusta-Richmond County Attorney; and Cathy Pirtle, Certified Court Reporter. MR. HANDY: Will the meeting please come to order. Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. We are here today to discuss the parking of Broad Street. We have heard from numerous business owners concerning the parking. We have heard some negative and we've heard some pluses. This meeting was called tonight -- [Off the record momentarily -- mechanical difficulty.] MR. HANDY: -- you do not. I just ask -- it would make the meeting much easier, but you have a right to say what you like regardless. You can speak for yourself. MS. WILLIAMS: I agree. In the interest of saving time, it would, but we've -- I don't think anyone here has said that any one person is going to, so could we have a few minutes to just perhaps select someone to speak first. MR. HANDY: You may. And then -- let me ask, all of us is one big happy family here today, anyone have a problem with that? PUBLIC CITIZEN: Are you saying that you're only going to have one person speaking for and one person against? MR. HANDY: No, that's not exactly what I'm saying. What I am saying is that it would be much easier to conduct the meeting if we had a spokesperson for and against, but each and every one of you have the right to ask questions and voice your concern. And that's what we're here tonight for, to hear from you all to let us know what you want so we can make an intelligent decision how to handle the parking on Broad Street. PUBLIC CITIZEN: Is this just for Broad Street? Your announcement said downtown. MR. HANDY: Downtown. Okay, whatever the announcement said, what we advertised, that's what we have to live with. PUBLIC CITIZEN: Could you clarify exactly what the new plan would be? What are you anticipating? MR. HANDY: Well, basically let me -- I will ask the Clerk to read the motion, what we discussed at our last meeting, and then if you have a problem with that, then we can ask questions concerning that particular meeting; okay? Ms. Bonner? CLERK: The motion was that we go back to the two-hour parking for the entire length of Broad Street and try to determine how we can best utilize the parking deck. PUBLIC CITIZEN: Is that from East Boundary to Milledge Road, the entire length of Broad Street? CLERK: It's probably where they have the limited parking in the aisles. The 13th through 5th Street, I believe, isn't it? MR. POWELL: That's correct. CLERK: Yeah, 13th through 5th. PUBLIC CITIZEN: How do you define the entire length of Broad Street? It's only 5th through 13th or 5th through 15th? CLERK: No, 5th through the 13th. MR. HANDY: 5th through the 13th. PUBLIC CITIZEN: Excuse me. Isn't it appropriate that there be a consideration that there be different parking for different sections of Broad Street based on the needs? I don't think you can fit everybody in one category. MR. HANDY: That's why we are here tonight, to make that determination. We are here just to listen tonight. We will not make a decision tonight. We are here to get the input from you all. MR. STEELE: Can I say something? MR. HANDY: Sure you can. MR. STEELE: I think you might have thrown us for a loop a little bit in that most of us don't want to come here and stake out a position that is totally for or against, so I'm not sure that any of us in the room want to say, you know, I'm on the positive side or the negative side. CLERK: Excuse me, could we have your name, sir? MR. STEELE: My name is David Steele and I'm the owner of the Window Gallery in the 1100 block of Broad Street. What we want to do is to have a constructive solution. Four months ago when we came before this body, we had made a proposal at the time that we return to the previous position that we had had in the downtown area, that we wanted unrestricted parking in the median on the 10, 11, and 1200 block, which is a less congested section of Broad Street. We did not want to change the parking in the middle section of Broad Street. I think a lot of people who are here today are upset that that was changed because that section of downtown has a much denser population, there are more office workers and so on. What we wanted to try to do is to return to the previous status quo, which was to say that in the sections of Broad Street where there are no parking garages or parking decks, that some provision must be made for customers and employees. Our solution at the time was to ask that you have the Sheriff strictly enforce curbside parking. You know, we wanted the Sheriff to give out tickets for people that parked in excess of two hours on the curb because all of us want our customers to be able to park. But many of us are in a position where we do not have parking behind our stores or our employees are scared to park behind our stores. There have been people mugged on these back streets, especially in the winter when it's dark. People don't want to go back to the, you know, Ellis Street or the Jones Street area to go out to their cars at night. There's a lot of female employees, and men too, that don't want to risk life and limb to park. And my position is that I want to run a viable business on Broad Street. I employ 22 people between my business on Broad and my business on Hale Street. We want to be downtown. Now, in the previous administration when we decided to locate to Broad Street, the upper section of Broad Street was basically a ghost town. You know, it was a rundown section of Broad Street. There were a few viable businesses, but it didn't look anywhere near as good as it looks today. I went to the mayor's office and asked about parking and was told that a decision had been made to allow us to have some employee parking out in the median. I would never have located my business to Broad Street if I had not been given that commitment, and I think many of the people that are here today in this room feel the same way. The antique store owners have told me their customers come to Broad Street, they spend the whole day. They go from store to store, they look for bargains, they go to eat at restaurants. It's an event for them to come down. The people at Artist's Row, they have events where they have teaching, where they have classes, where their customers come down and spend four hours learning how to paint. We are in a different -- we have a different set of needs than other sections of Broad Street. Now, the comment was made about how do you define Broad Street. I think the motion was the entire Broad Street. And the point that we want to argue tonight is that at the last meeting four months ago the Sheriff expressed a desire that there be consistency. Well, we want -- I think the -- I don't know who wants to be the pluses and the minuses. I guess because I'm the first one that got up we can stake out the plus. What we want to do is argue for a positive solution, and what we want to say is that we want a just public policy. You know, just saying we're being fair by making the entire section of Broad Street the same is unfair where there are different needs within the city. We have a need to revitalize Broad Street. A lot of us have put a lot of money into trying to bring back this downtown section. A lot of people are threatening to leave if their customers can't park. Other people are saying if our employees can't park they're not going to work for us. Now, it's -- I forget what it is, $45 -- $65 for a parking ticket. We can't afford to have our employees going out every two hours and jockeying their cars into different spots on Broad Street. So maybe that can serve as an opening statement. I'm not an elected spokesman. I don't know that either side came prepared to do that, but I know that what we want is a reasonable solution. There are people that have some creative ideas about the possibility of decals. I think you all realize that down the road that we're going to need some provision for some additional parking in the upper ends of Broad Street, that retail merchants -- customers are not going to park in the 900 parking deck -- 900 block parking deck and in the rain or bad weather walk up to the 1300 block of Broad Street. So as the Golf Hall of Fame comes and, you know, maybe the James Brown Museum, whatever happens in that end of Broad, you know, we need some parking decks there like they have in the mid section of Broad Street. So thank you for your time. MR. HANDY: Thank you, sir. Anyone like to add or subtract? MR. FAKE: Yes, sir. I'm Stanley Fake; I have Antique World Mall on the 1100 block of Broad as well as the Antique World Wall on Washington Road. I opened a business April 1st a year ago. I've been here 15 months, but I was born and raised on the 200 block of Broad. I have seen it from 53 years ago. I remember in the '40s and '50s when there were more people on any section of Broad Street than is in this room. Every store was full of customers. There was no such thing as a shopping mall. We did not have a parking problem. The problem is recent and it's been blown out of proportion, in my opinion. You've got two separate parking systems on Broad Street. You've got the 5, the 6, the 10, 11 and 1200 block that is the same structurally. You've got the 7, 8 and 900 that is structurally different. Well, the 7, 8 and 900 block -- I spent five years on the 900 block with my drapery business, and at 9th and Ellis the parking deck was always full. If we paid by the month, we paid $13 a month. If you parked daily, I think it was something like a dollar. And the deck was full. Through the lack of security, people were jumping the walls, vandalizing the cars in the parking deck, mugging the people, and finally the attendant was shot. For the last four or five years you've had four or five cars park in the deck. For those three blocks, the simplest solution is wrought iron bars in-between the first and the second floor. And the attendant, if you come in, walk in or drive in, you have to pass the attendant. You eliminate the security problems, within 30 days your parking deck would be full. That would solve the solution from the 7, 8 and 900 block, but it still leaves the 5, 6, 10, 11 and 1200 block. And, frankly, we do not have a problem if we go back to what was established in the '40s and the '50s, which is the way the structure is set up right now. Every address on each of those blocks was set up with two parking spaces in the median per address. If you count the addresses, multiply it by two, that's how many spaces there are in the median. That left the curbs vacant for retail parking. Now, I'm not saying whether we need to go to stickers or what. I have four addresses, which would be eight stickers. I don't need but two, so as a good merchant I would take my six stickers and give them to somebody that needs them. If I wanted to be greedy, I could sell them. But if I park on the curb, give me a $100 ticket because I don't belong on the curb, because I belong in the median because I'm working there. Because I don't have parking on Ellis Street or anywhere else, I have to park on Broad. My dealers have to park on Broad. But at the same time, I need that parking on the curb for my retail customers or I'm out of business. Thank you. MR. HANDY: Thank you. Anyone else? MS. WILLIAMS: I want to take exception with all this talk about there being a safety problem on Broad Street in downtown Augusta. We have people here who live in downtown Augusta. I've had a business on Broad Street for over 20 years myself. I work late two or three nights every week and I have never seen a problem. I think we're giving our city a bad rap to stand up here and say that people are being mugged and raped and that sort of thing. I take exception to that kind of talk. Also, I'm in the 1000 block. Don't include us in the block that doesn't need unlimited parking because there are -- and mine is a big store. I'd have ten parking spaces that would be assigned to me. But we have to think about the business community as a whole. If we don't have parking for customers throughout the entire length of Broad Street, we will not have business to come to us. When the retail merchants and the professional people who have no parking for their clientele fold up, all of downtown Augusta folds up. We've wasted all the money we've spent on riverside development, we've wasted all the money on the facade grants, and we are once again a town with a slum area for a downtown. Businesses and industry do not come to places that have a downtown area that's like that. I just think that we have got to do something that is consistent from 5th to 13th. I know there are people who take exception to this, but we are all members of a family, a family of businesses, and we have to think of what's good for everybody, not what's good for us. The taxpayers do not owe us a parking space for our employees. That's up to us to furnish parking for our employees. However we get it, that's another thing that we have to solve ourselves, but I don't think that we need to be looking to the taxpayers in general to give us parking for our employees. That just means higher taxes, and I don't think we need them. That's what I have to say. MR. HANDY: Thank you very much. MR. POWELL: Mr. Chairman, could we get these people's name and if they own a business on the record, please, so that we can go back and review these minutes? MR. OSBON: Mr. Chairman? MR. HANDY: Yes, Mr. Osbon? MR. OSBON: My name is Julian Osbon; I'm with Osbon Medical Systems. And as someone who has been in the downtown area all of his working career -- my father moved onto Broad Street the year I was born, which I won't tell you how long ago it was, but it's been quite a few years, and we've been downtown ever since. And several years ago I started Osbon Medical Systems in the downtown area after a retail business that we had closed. I have the option to move that business anywhere. My business could be in Columbia County; I've had people from other states try to recruit me to move my business to those other areas. I'm very committed to the downtown area, but I have about 180 employees that come into the downtown area every day and they have to have a place to park. I don't look for anyone to provide that to them; we do a great deal of that ourselves. In the last two years I have spent -- my family and my business has spent several million dollars in renovating buildings, buying property. A year ago we had 30 off-street parking places. Today we have 90 that we pay for and that we have built. We took the old bank building at the corner of 13th and Broad and added about 40/45 spaces there to take cars off of Broad Street. I bought the building -- the old Pepsi-Cola building over on Ellis Street. We've got a distribution center there. We've got about 40 parking places there. We built those parking places intentionally to get people off of Broad Street. We currently pay or subsidize another 30 or so parking places. But even with all of this I still have a number of employees that have to find a place to park. We have a building in the middle of the 1000 block of Broad Street, and my people are very careful to avoid taking over the needed parking places, although I think in some occasions my people have been accused of parking and taking parking places. But we've been very careful to try to avoid that. We're very interested in downtown Augusta, and we think that downtown Augusta has not seen its best days. The best days are yet to come with all the things going on on Riverfront and all the development, and we think that the future of this area is in downtown. We realize that when all of this development happens, that the parking situation is going to get -- we don't have a problem now, we'll have a problem in a few years if we start getting this million and a half tourists that's going to be coming in to the downtown area. We're going to have to build parking decks, no question about it. There's going to be two, three, maybe four parking decks needed in the downtown area. I'm working on some groups that are trying to plan for that. I think what we've got right now is a situation that has to have -- be considered temporary, and what we need is the ability for the merchants to have some of their people, if necessary, park in the median. In the 10, 11, 1200 block of Broad Street, which are the ones that I'm primarily interested in, we've gone out on many days -- I've had my people go out, and I've got statistics here and I could bore you with them, but we can document that there is not a parking problem in the 10 and 1100 block and 1200 block of Broad Street at most times. Very seldom we find -- we surveyed; we find that there are parking places there. We keep our people off Broad Street, we subsidize, we pay for part of their parking. So I think what we've got to do is, in the best interest of the community, I think we're going to have to work through this temporary period until we can come up with a long-term solution. But like David Steele suggested, and I totally support what he suggested, is that we look at the 10, 11 and 1200 block of Broad Street different than we do some of the more congested areas. The needs are different. And as somebody who's very committed to downtown, I want to see it -- I want to see this area continue to grow, and it's going to take this group to make the kind of decision that will support the continuation of these small merchants and those who are a little bit larger able to be in the downtown area. So, you know, I encourage you to, as you look at this, don't simply force these merchants, including some people that work for me, into having to go out every two hours and move their cars around and play the games, because that doesn't make sense. I think we should all be responsible and do the best we can, and that's what we're trying to do as part of my company. But I appreciate the time you've given me. Thank you very much for your time. MR. HANDY: Thank you, Mr. Osbon. MR. TODD: Before Mr. Osbon sit down, I had a -- MR. HANDY: Mr. Todd has a question for you, Mr. Osbon. MR. TODD: I had a question for Mr. Osbon and possibly Mr. Steele, too. And that is that, one, would it work better if we get the two sides together or get at least some individuals, two or three from each side, to sit down and work this thing out as far as what the policy should be? We had one group to come down and we made a policy decision based on what they brought us, and then we learned that there was another opposing group, so that group come down and I think we modified that position. And when we're dealing with planning and zoning issues, oftentimes we send the two groups, the opposing group and the group that want to change the zoning, to sit down and try to work it out and bring it back to us, and I just wonder would that methodology work by any chance. MR. OSBON: Mr. Todd, I think that's a very appropriate suggestion. Frankly, I think everyone in this room wants to do what's best for the Augusta area, and particularly in the downtown area. I don't think there's a single person in here that isn't for doing the right thing. So I'm sure that if we brought together people of different ideas, that it could be talked through, and I would be very supportive of doing something like that. I think we have to think of it as a short-term solution, and then long term we're going to have to do something differently. And we're talking about parking decks, in my opinion. MR. HANDY: Thank you, sir. MR. TODD: Thank you. MR. STEELE: Can I respond? MR. J. BRIGHAM: Mr. Handy, let me ask Mr. Osbon one question. MR. HANDY: We have Rob next after Mr. Steele, and then you can -- MR. J. BRIGHAM: Well, I know, but -- Julian, in your opinion, what is it going to take to use the city parking deck at 9th and Ellis that we now own that's not being used, other than security, and we are looking at putting security in there. MR. OSBON: All right. I've heard some pretty good suggestions, and I - - that's come up at some of these meetings that I've been involved with. I think that we can use that resource. We may have to redirect the entrance. The way of getting in and out is a little bit awkward. Security is part of it. There even could be a process where there is a shuttle service. If people were secure, I think people would be willing to park there if they had the ability to get back and forth to their vehicles, you know, fairly easily. But I agree with you, that's a resource that has to be used, and I think there are some things that could be done to make it useful. MR. HANDY: Okay. Mr. Steele? MR. STEELE: Yes. To answer Mr. Todd's question, I think everybody wants to come up with, you know, a workable solution for all the merchants. I don't know anybody that I've talked to that isn't willing to sit down with everybody and discuss that. What we had suggested before was that we do need a short-term solution, and that's what we had proposed earlier was that we, you know, allow some employee parking now, knowing that two or three years from now, you know, we ought to get back together and revisit that issue. Part of the problem is that, you know, opposing groups came to your committee, I guess the Engineering Committee, and the public wasn't fully aware of what was happening. I know you had published it, but we were either a lot of us out of town or unaware of what was happening. But public meetings like this are very helpful, I think all of us can air our ideas, but we do need some short-term solution. You know, we can't have a situation where our employees can't park. And I know that the people down in the very congested parts of Broad Street are very upset. You know, they would like to see us go back to restricting that middle part of the road in the short-term, but all in favor of a long-term working group to get together. MR. HANDY: Okay. Mr. Zetterberg? MR. ZETTERBERG: I think my question evolved out of what Mr. Osbon and Mr. Steele said. Is there anybody in the room that operates in the 10 to 1200 block who has a differing opinion from these two gentlemen? [No response.] So obviously it's not -- MR. KUHLKE: You have a gentleman over here, Rob. PUBLIC CITIZEN: I'm a South Carolinian. MR. ZETTERBERG: But I'm saying, do you -- is that where your business is, in the 10 to 1200 block? MS. WILLIAMS: Yes. Retail businesses. MR. ZETTERBERG: In the 10 to 1200 block? MS. WILLIAMS: In the 1000 block. We should not be included. MR. ZETTERBERG: Okay. That's all I wanted to know. MR. STEELE: Can I clarify something? MR. JOHNSON: Could someone else have a opportunity -- he's pretty much monopolized the time -- and let somebody with an opposing view talk, please? MR. HANDY: Go ahead. MR. JOHNSON: My name is Cedric Johnson with Allied Bank, and I'm representing Allied. About six months ago Allied made a move to invest in coming to downtown Augusta. At that time there was two-hour parking in the median, and that was very necessary for us to have our customers have a place to park. Now, there have been some things said, and we are willing to work with everybody, but it's essential that in the median, especially in the 700 block and those congested areas, that we do go back to the two-hour parking. Now, the other problem that we have is enforcement. You have officers that are writing tickets, but there is no enforcement of those tickets. So some kind of way, I don't know if this Commission, whoever, has to come up with a way to, once a ticket is written, that these people don't have seven/eight/nine/ ten tickets in their pockets that they are not paying because there is no way to enforce that. A suggestion would be to maybe turn those over to Motor Vehicle when people go to get their tags or whatever and then they have them paid. But right now you have people laughing at the process because they know they can get all these tickets and there's no one to enforce them. Now, whether the government should be responsible for providing places for private individuals, I'm not sure if that's right or wrong, but I can tell you that I would be willing to work with whoever to come up with a solution that everybody can live with. Thank you. MR. HANDY: Thank you, Mr. Johnson. Before we get too far into this meeting, we have a report from Mr. George Patty, and they've done some study. Our problem is not in the upper part of Broad Street, our problem is the lower part of Broad Street. The problem that we have as a governing body is that we can't say that -- well, I can't say as a member of this body that one end of Broad Street have to be one way, the other end have to be another. I know you all that is in business would like to say that start from 9th Street and go east and take care of that problem, start from 9th Street and go west and leave it as it is. We here as Commissioners set policies. The Sheriff do the enforcement. The Sheriff is a constitutional officer, get elected by all of you all that lives in Richmond County. He makes the decision about writing tickets or whether he's going to enforce the tickets. We could set a resolution and sit here and say that we want Broad Street -- a certain section of Broad Street be designated as this way, and he will have to enforce that. But I am here as an individual to say that we should treat everyone equal. The problem is not in the 10, 11, 12, 1300 block of Broad Street. We are well aware of that. But how can you distinguish between the lower part of Broad and the higher part of Broad and make a correct and intelligent decision about the parking? We must rely on you all as individuals that is in business. Tonight before we leave here I'm probably going to set up a committee. You all get together and try to work out the problem, come back before this body and give us your results, and then we'll make a decision how we're going to handle the parking on Broad Street. You all are in business to make money, not to lose money. We are well aware of your customers, we are well aware of your concerns, we are well aware of your complaints, but you all as a business family must get together and come together so you all would be beneficial -- this will be beneficial to all of you instead of just some of you. And anyone that have any other information that they could share with this Commissioner, I would be appreciative for it, and then I would like to turn it over to any of my colleagues to give some suggestions for whatever we could do in order to alleviate the problem that we have on the parking of Broad Street. But we are well aware that the problem is not in the upper part of Broad Street, it's in the lower part of Broad Street. Mr. Beard? MR. BEARD: Mr. Handy, I think that the best solution I've heard here tonight is maybe that -- getting together, because I don't think we as a body could possibly know all the problems that exist down on Broad Street. And so I do like the idea of the committee structure getting together out there with the merchants on Broad Street and both groups coming up with the best possible solution, because I think all of these people are fair-minded people and all of them want -- are looking out for the interest of the city, and I think that would be the best solution. Also, there's another item on 7th Street, and we have Mr. Walker here and I think he wanted to address that for just a few minutes because this would be off-parking on 7th Street. MR. WALKER: I'm Hamp Walker; I live on One 7th Street, which is Port Royal Science Center. I'm president of the homeowners association of the condominium. We have some 120 people. We have a situation that is different from our merchants in the Broad Street area in that we have a one-block area of entrance from Reynolds to the building. It's a very beautiful street. Y'all paid for it. It's brick, it's landscaped, it's got lanterns, it's very narrow, and it's very beautiful. We had no problem until a couple of months ago. It was a no-parking area for safety as well as movement, and there was no situation that presented any problem. It was changed to one side being no parking, the other side to be two-hour parking, and since that time we have had a problem. The area that is no parking is daily abused by cars in the no-parking zone, not ticketed, pulled up on the sidewalk blocking the sidewalk, making people who use your parking lot at Port Royal have to walk in the street to come and go. There's plenty of parking around Davidson's, in your parking area of the Port Royal, at the NationsBank, so there is adequate space for anyone who needs to park. They do not need to park in the street. We have a safety problem not only in -- the sidewalks are daily. This is an event that happens every day. I live there, it's right out my window, I see it every day. In the two-hour zone there are no tickets written. There are vehicles that are placed there - - there's one that's been there for three months. I'm not sure it's even operative and can be driven, but I know it's been there because I see it every day. And I have listened to our people. There is a concern with the blockage of this street. And then when the wrecker comes in and is left in the street, unattended, there is a blockage of that street, and if someone has a medical problem, needs to get out and go to the hospital, they can't get through there. We have a blocked street. We ask your help. We would like and hope that it could return back to no parking so that we could have a clear street to use. Thank you. MR. HANDY: Thank you. MR. FINLEY: Mr. Handy, I'm Johnny Finley from United Loan, the 1000 block of Broad. So far tonight I've heard that we have plenty of parking on the 1000 block, and if we had all that parking all these merchants here wouldn't be here tonight. Now, about two weeks ago they did give us some relief from Osbon Medical, and they moved, but up until this time we've not had any parking on the 1000 block for our customers. And don't go with the myth that everybody on the 1000 block is happy, because we aren't. Thank you, sir. MR. HANDY: Thank you. Anyone else? Yes? State your name for the record, please. MS. THURMOND: My name is Deanna Thurmond, and I have worked downtown for about eight years. Since the parking problem has become such a problem as it is with unlimited parking on Broad Street, the business that I work in, which is in the 1000 block of Broad Street, all the parking spaces are full all day, most of which are filled by employees and/or business owners of the 1000 block of Broad Street. What I am up here to ask you is that the Commission make a decision that is going to be good for the majority of people. You're not going to be able to make a decision that's going to make everybody here happy. Most of the businesses in Broad Street area are either retail or they are professional: lawyer's offices, that type of thing. These people do not have a lot -- or very often a customer or client that comes in and stays for more than two hours. My question to them is why is unlimited parking such an issue. If you don't have people there for more than two hours but on a very occasional basis, why is two-hour parking a problem? I think two-hour parking would solve more problems for more people than having unlimited parking. We need unlimited parking. We've got a lot of employees parking on the street, which is taking up spaces for our customers and clients whether it be the business I work at or anybody else's business here. I'm just asking that you make a decision that will benefit the majority of the people, not just a few individuals. MR. HANDY: Thank you. Yes, sir? MR. RULE: Hello, my name is Todd Rule and I work for Osbon Medical. I'm responsible for the employees in the 1000 block. I'd like to respond to Mr. Finley's comments. There is ample parking pretty much all day long there. I come in and out of that building repeatedly. I usually walk up for the exercise -- up to the 1300 block to meet with other employees. But over the last, I would say, two months I have never once walked out of that building ever where there hasn't been at least five parking places in the 1000 block. MS. THURMOND: But how many businesses are in the 1000 block? MR. HANDY: Excuse me. Give him a chance to say what he needs to say. Thank you. MR. RULE: That's pretty much all I wanted to say. And I guess I would challenge everybody in this room when they do drive up and down Broad Street during business hours to take a look at the parking places available. They are there. I'm not sure what Mr. Finley's seeing, and I'm not trying to get in an argumentative situation with him at all. All I'm trying to say is that there are parking spots available right now. Osbon Medical Systems has done everything in their power. We've rented from Cobern, we've rented from -- also from Reynold's Furniture at our expense to try to pull some of our people off of Broad Street. But I just want to reiterate, there are parking spots available in the 1000 block, and you can go down there any time during the day and you can scoot right into a parking place and go about to do your business if that's what you want to do. That's all I needed to say. Thanks. MR. HANDY: Okay, thank you. Yes, sir? MR. BEE: Yes, I'm Robert Bee from Cobern Furniture Company. I would just caution us on this one thing -- and I've been on Broad Street over 40 years -- and that is I have always rented parking places for my employees to park behind my store. I've never had an incident or any problems with employees being mugged or anything. But I would caution us, if we give free parking on Broad Street, any merchants that are paying to rent property for parking is going to say why pay to park in the back of my store when I can let my employees park on Broad Street. So I think that's going to create an additional problem because they're going to give up those spaces and we're going to have more people parking on Broad Street. Thank you. CLERK: Can we get your last name, sir? MR. BEE: Bee. MR. HANDY: Okay. Anyone else? MR. DAVENPORT: My wife owns Artistic Perceptions in the 500 block of Broad Street. We -- CLERK: Your name, sir? MR. DAVENPORT: Roy Davenport, James Roy Davenport. And we've lived there -- you know, we live in our business. In the back of the business we have our own parking. We've lived there for about five years. And as far as safety is concerned, we have never had any problem whatsoever. About two and a half years ago there were signs all down that section of the 500 block of Broad Street that says two-hour parking, and we complained that it wasn't being enforced on the side. We asked that the center be free parking but that the street side be two-hour parking. The response we received at that time was they came out and took all the signs down that says two-hour parking. So it's free parking on the side. We have occasions, not all the time but a lot of occasions where the parking -- people pull in those parking places, walk away, I don't know where they go, but the car is there for five/six hours during the daytime and block this curbside parking. And so that's the only problem we have. We don't have a problem with safety as far as that's concerned. MR. HANDY: Thank you. MR. DAVENPORT: And, also, there's some parking that is available in the new museum in the evenings if that -- but it's not lighted where anybody feels safe going in there. MR. HANDY: Yes, sir? MR. FAKE: Yes, sir. I think somebody took something I said wrong. I was the one that said there was a security problem. The security problem I was referring to was in the parking deck at 9th and Ellis. That's why everybody quit parking there. And if you don't think so, ask the attendant that worked for the city that was shot. That is one area that if you're going to use the parking deck, secure it. Security bars is the cheapest way to do it, with an attendant. I'm not talking about the rest of Broad Street. I haven't seen problems in years. On Ellis Street -- the vehicles are broken into almost every night on the 1000 block of Broad -- I'm sorry, the 1100 block of Broad. A lot of the problems on the 1000 block of Ellis are not the same because they have fenced-in back yards with security gates. We don't have that on the 1100 block of Broad. MR. HANDY: Thank you, sir. Anyone else? Okay, David. MR. MORETZ: My name is David Moretz and I work at Sherman & Hemstreet at 123 Eighth Street. I'm one of the ones that is a two-hour parker, moving the car back and forth. I've worked in downtown Augusta for about eight years now and I've seen the problems in the 7, 8 and 900 block; I've seen the opportunities in the 10, 11 and 12 grow. I think the Commission has a great challenge because we have this opportunity, an opportunity that did not exist five years ago, six years ago -- and I will compliment Mr. Osbon -- before he committed to downtown, to have employees downtown that eat lunch, shop, hopefully buy office furniture. Years ago I leased space at 601 Broad Street -- this was about 13,000 square feet -- to Bechtel. Unfortunately, they had to move over to Aiken. But at that time we didn't have 80 parking spaces at 601 Broad Street, but I leased them from the city back off Reynolds. You know, it was a creative gesture. Of course, we paid the city $10 a month and we got all that money recouped. You know, there's an opportunity for a lot of growth long term with -- I know as Mr. Osbon knows and Mr. Kuhlke knows and many others know -- in building more parking decks long term, hopefully situated where it can alleviate a lot of problems for myself who tries to lease office space in downtown Augusta and retail space in downtown Augusta and for tenants and landlords and business owners to be able to park in some of these hopefully proposed parking decks in the future. Now, right now you do have a short- term problem, which is an opportunity. All the merchants and restaurateurs and business owners, we need to applaud them for coming downtown. And, again, you're not going to make them all happy. You don't make me happy when I get a parking ticket, but I know I'm in the wrong when I do. I've been fortunate not to have one of the newer tickets that went from 10 to 20 to 40 bucks. I learned my lesson when I had a hundred or so in the file last year, or two years ago: you pay your tickets, don't let them build up, because they do enforce them. But I challenge you because you do have an opportunity. I as a leasing agent of office space have an opportunity to lease up more space, but parking is always a problem. We encourage the building of parking decks. The ones that have been built in the past were to serve particular needs, but they didn't serve a lot of the needs of these merchants and myself as a leasing agent and some of the vacant space. But I encourage you, and I congratulate all these merchants for being here because six years ago you didn't have the problem. And I applaud the City of Augusta for all the work they've done on Riverwalk and downtown Augusta, and I'm sure you'll make the right decision. It may not make us all happy, and hopefully you'll have this committee of merchants and businessmen that affect the 10, 11 and 1200 block because that is a different problem than what we had or the perception is of the 7, 8 and 900 block problem. But I encourage you, and that's all I have to say. Thank you. MR. HANDY: Thank you, David. Yes, sir? MR. IRVIN: My name is Willis Irvin, Jr., and I'm a former City Councilman. Back in the 1950's we had this problem, a much bigger problem than we have now. I remember walking down Broad Street one time and we had people passing out parking tickets, and it was re-election time and people would come up to me and say if you don't take my parking ticket and take care of it, I'm not going to vote for you. So this was a big problem, and it's been a big problem for Augusta for these 40 years. I have an interest in downtown Augusta again after 40 years, and we've got to find some way to work this parking out so that we can compete with the malls. That's our biggest problem. Everybody's got to have free parking: employees, customers, everybody like that. We've got some buildings in downtown Augusta that I have the plans for that my father, an architect, had. And some of these buildings are 125 years old; they've served their time. We could take that space and make parking areas out of it --spaces up and down Broad Street. That's a possibility and that's the main possibility that I see that we have to solve this problem. Otherwise, we've got to completely recycle the downtown and figure some way to merchandise the things that we have to sell a little bit better. They've done this in Charleston, South Carolina; they've overcome their problem. They've done it Sumter, South Carolina, and Chattanooga and different places. I think we can do it in Augusta, and I have a vision that we will accomplish this some day. Thank you. MR. HANDY: Thank you, sir. Anyone else? Yes, Mr. Mays? MR. MAYS: If no other member of the audience has anything. MR. HANDY: Okay. Go ahead. MR. MAYS: First I guess a question, and then I wanted to make a comment. Is there any active, organized, ongoing group outside of government -- and government's not doing it, so I'm saying outside of it --that's working, whether it be Broad Street or, say, downtown, is there a downtown working group that exists right now that's working and meeting? PUBLIC CITIZEN: Main Street Augusta. MR. MAYS: Okay. I mean, but that's addressing this particular issue. Okay. What I was going to suggest, Mr. Mayor Pro Tem, is that there obviously is a planning problem, one that has to be solved. We get back to short-term - - we talk about short-term and long-term. This is not to put any more pressure on George Patty's office that isn't already there, but I think to address what we're talking about, if it's going to be dealing with parking, whether it's getting to the existing, unused deck that we got right now, whether it's for building them in the future, whether it's going this side of Broad Street, whether it's going closer to the river, I think that, George, maybe your group in this particular issue maybe needs to serve as the facilitator. I mean, you are there; you are Director of Planning and Zoning. One thing that's obviously absent, and it's not a criticism tonight, I've heard a lot about law enforcement, whether we're talking about the enforcement of the tickets or whether it's the perception of everything needing to be the same or there needs to be some creative variations of what happens on Broad Street or on the side streets that run north and south, because they also have to be considered in the downtown parking corridor. I think that maybe we need to, whether there is a sign-up situation here or not tonight -- and, George, we're going to make you the unofficial secretary because we're going to have to be here after you leave and you make a little bit more than we do -- that we need to get some folk to sign up with Mr. Patty tonight and at least try and get an ad hoc group of people working. I've always lived by the attitude you can work a lot better planning with people than planning for people. It may not be perfect in what we'll come out with with the first round of this, but one of the things that I've heard lurking -- and I'm going to go ahead on and say this. Y'all know when I get something I can't hold it. That I've heard that on the enforcement side of this that, well, you know, maybe some folk can't make up their mind whether or not they want it this way, they want it that way. There are a lot of variations that may have to go into this situation. There are a lot of you that have had some growing and suffering and staying pains to remain downtown, whether it's on Broad Street or whether it's just in the downtown corridor, that you're still alive, you're still there. And I think in order to make it grow we need to keep that group together working and talking, and I think George's office can be the best facilitator as far as government's concerned to make sure that -- in terms of not only listening to business and professional people there but as well as with law enforcement. And this is not to tell the Sheriff any way what to do about his law enforcement business, but I do think you're looking at something that we've not talked about. We are coming into a situation where you have some people even in that category that have not had to deal, maybe from a leadership standpoint, with problems in the municipal area of downtown Augusta, so they've not had that before. Maybe one creative thing of doing it, and law enforcement -- maybe somebody who has worked out of old APD could be assigned to this particular group to work in helping to coordinate that effort rather than just in normal traffic functions. Because if somebody's had that experience for doing it for 10/15/17 years and is already on board doing something else, then maybe that person or persons could be assigned to work with this group. They've had to do it in their old capacities, utilize them now; they're still there. And I think that would help us at least get a start on what we're doing. Then when we come back, it may not be perfect, but at least then we can get something that we get a feel if there are variances that need to be and if there are different needs in different blocks. If it takes that in the short run to stay and to make it work, then we make it work. And, I mean, I've seen us do far more costly and creative things and blunders in this town over the last 20 years than we have in terms of trying to deal with this in terms of a traffic problem. And I think this can give the impetus for a growing group that can stay together, then on what you do as far as expansion in future years. Because obviously if all of these things are going to come downtown, if we're going to attract them, then -- you know, any of you that went to the Olympics, you know that you basically -- you didn't park free. And non-Olympic time, if you're going to the Georgia Capitol, if you're going downtown, whether it's Underground, wherever it is, you've got to have parking. And you may not be able to drive up to the door of wherever you're going. It has to put a little bit in your legs, and exercise helps a little bit. It even takes two pounds off of my fat self now and then to do it. But I think putting that group together, facilitate it through Mr. Patty's office, the long run -- his office is going to be in charge of basically everything that's planned, zoned and changed, and I think that can be a start of working with that. And Main Street is good and Main Street is good in dealing with it, but I think you've got an immediate problem that maybe needs to be pulled out and separated and put a working group together, and let George and those do that and help coordinate it. And of making sure, George, that you've got law enforcement at every one of those meetings so that they can understand the sensitivity that if variations have to occur, then it cannot be the main focus -- it's not to be made simplified so that it's easier to write a ticket, that it's made simplified so that you can make it business friendly and that we can keep those folk down there in business that's trying to stay in business. MR. HANDY: Mr. Todd? MR. TODD: I guess I want a clarification on the groups, that we are proposing that we break it off at 11th Street or 9th Street or where. In the sense that there's two different needs, I would hate to have the folks on the 5th Street end planning for the folks on the 13th Street end or 11th Street. So is there any way that we can break it down where you have two different groups, one planning for one end and one planning for the other, and where is the central location that we can do the dividing line where there's different needs? Or would we want to --would the groups want to plan all together for the entire corridor of Broad Street from the 5th Street through the 15th Street or 13th Street? MR. HANDY: Mr. Todd, I have a list of names that I'm going to submit to you all in a few moments and you'll have that opportunity to make that decision. MR. TODD: Well, I don't want to make that decision. I want the folks that it involves or have investments down there on the merchant side and the professional side to make the decision. MR. HANDY: The decision I was referring to is that you all as a body accept the names that I give you for this committee. That's the decision that I was referring to. MR. TODD: Yes. I don't have a problem with that, Mr. Mayor Pro Tem, as long as the folks out there don't have a problem with the list. I think they've got to live with the list, too. MR. HANDY: Thank you. Samm? MS. FUSSELLE: I just wanted to say that, yes, there is a problem, as we all know, and I just would like to reiterate the fact that each block is different. It has its own needs and its own personality. I would like also to address the parking deck that so many people have mentioned. As you on the -- CLERK: Samm, would you go to the mike, please? MS. FUSSELLE: I'm sorry. I thought I had a mouth big enough. And I would like to address the questions that came up about the parking deck on 9th and Greene and James Brown Boulevard. Those that are in the Engineering Committee, I made a presentation -- I think I made two presentations several months ago, and they approved and the total Commission approved that that parking deck, that we completely enclose it with a fencing that is like the one at Port Royal, that we move the cage that's in there to the entrance that would face Ellis Street -- excuse me, James Brown Boulevard. Everything else would be fenced in so that nobody could go through another entrance. It would be one entrance in and one entrance out. On my desk I have a bid proposal that the Commission voted to put that garage out for bid to privatize it. It is sitting on my desk to be delivered to Mr. Wall in the morning for his legal input, and then we want to see what will happen with that. I want to also mention that, you know, downtown is growing. In the last seven years or six and a half years that the Main Street program has been in effect, the changes that I have seen have just been unbelievable. But I know I sent an update to Linda Beazley this week about my department, about Main Street, and I keep a running tab of people that call me and want information about downtown. This past month in July I had over 40 phone calls from people wanting information about buildings or space or something to do with downtown. It averages for the past year anywhere from 25 to 50 phone calls a month, and that's a lot of people that are interested in downtown. I have realtors from West Augusta calling and saying you've got to tell me about downtown because I have people coming in that are interested in buildings downtown and I don't know about it. We have two new restaurants that are going to be opening within the next two months, and these people need places to park. I have had people tell me that they don't come downtown for lunch anymore because there's no place to park. So it is something we need to address, and I feel that maybe a forming a committee is a very good idea. It's something that we've talked about. And just one other thing, we have started a downtown merchants association. It's called the Main Street Augusta Association. We meet the last Wednesday morning of -- the last Wednesday of the month, and we meet at different places. We have downtown businesses sponsor it, give door prizes, we have a speaker, and it's a chance for people like you to get together and to network. And I see very few people in this room that are members of that association, so you need to join and network, and it's things like this that we talk about at those meetings. MR. HANDY: Thank you, Samm. Give us your complete name. I know who you are, but the people out here need to know who you are. MS. FUSSELLE: Samm Fusselle. MR. HANDY: Okay, thank you. Anyone else? Mr. Beard, and then I'm going to appoint the committee. Go ahead. MR. BEARD: I would just hope, Mr. Chairman, that the committee look into not only Broad Street -- I keep hearing Broad Street, but we have more than that. We have Reynolds Street, we have Ellis Street, we have the parking deck, we have the off-street parking on 7th Street. So I'm just hoping that whatever committee that you appoint, that they will be looking into downtown parking period, the entire place from 5th Street back up to 13th and including the other off-street parking, too, and come up with something that we can live with short term. MR. HANDY: Thank you, sir. Anyone else? If not, I would like to recommend David Steele, Julian Osbon, Cedric Johnson, James Davenport, Samm Fusselle, and Homer Moore; and Samm and Homer to represent the government. I thought about putting a Commissioner on there, but we will make the decision, so I think we should stay off. And once we get the information back from this committee, then we will make a decision about downtown. And I'd like to put Mr. Patty as the chairman of this committee, and if he feel that he needs some other members of the downtown merchants, please feel free to add on whomever you like. But officially the members are the names that I just called, and this to be chaired by Mr. George Patty. MR. TODD: Mr. Mayor Pro Tem, will you name those again? MR. HANDY: David Steele, Julian Osbon, Cedric Johnson, and James Davenport, Samm Fusselle and Homer Moore. And George Patty will be -- PUBLIC CITIZEN: Are you not going to put any retailers on the committee that have retail shops? MR. HANDY: My statement was that that's the standing committee and anyone here tonight could volunteer to be on the committee. It's not set up here to eliminate anyone from being on there. You have a business downtown, you could serve on this committee. Mr. George Patty, which is sitting directly behind you, will be the chairman, and he would be glad to add you to the list. MR. TODD: Can we at least, Mr. Mayor Pro Tem, get a couple of retail folks to volunteer? And I think that certainly it would go a lot smoother that if they're planning together. I understand the needs of Mr. Osbon and Mr. Steele, and we certainly want them to be involved, but I think we have Mr. Finley and some other folks that's on the retail side, that we need to do somewhat of a mix so when we bring it back that we have some input from both sides. And the retail merchants will be able to go also to the -- to their representatives on there and kind of share their thoughts and ideas. MR. HANDY: Thank you, Mr. Todd. Also, Mr. Patty, I would like to add Captain Weaver to that committee as far as law enforcement, or his designee, whomever that the Sheriff would like to work with them. But I'd like to have Captain Weaver since he's over the traffic part, and he handled the Olympic torch bearing real well and he may can give some and shed some light on that. If there will not be any other questions, any other comments, we'd like to thank each and every one of you all for coming in. MR. PATTY: Mr. Handy, can I ask you one question? MR. HANDY: Yes, sir. MR. PATTY: I appreciate your confidence in me. I heard a little bit of conflicting direction here. Are we just looking at the short-term problem or are we looking at short and long-term problems. MR. HANDY: Well, right now I believe we're looking at the short-term problem till we make a decision about the parking deck and all that what we're going to do. And then, plus, we are still structuring this government, and by the time we come together the first of the year we should be -- have come up with some kind of decision that will be beneficial for everyone. If not, in order -- yes, sir? MR. DAVENPORT: I just wanted to make a motion that we set up a time and place for our first meeting so that we'll have some forward direction to go from here. MR. HANDY: Okay. Mr. Patty is going to -- the Clerk will give Mr. Patty the names that I called and the phone numbers. If you have a phone number, leave it with the Clerk, and then Mr. Patty will be able to set up that meeting and get in touch with each one of you all and let you know. MR. BEARD: Mr. Handy? MR. HANDY: Excuse me one second, Mr. Beard. Yes, sir? MR. MERRY: Can she read again what we're supposed to do now until all this other -- I'm a little confused. I mean, list them all now: limited parking -- MR. HANDY: No, right now we're not going to make any -- there's no -- we cannot make a decision here tonight. This is a public hearing to get the input from you all. MR. MERRY: No, she read something at the very beginning of the meeting the way it is now -- CLERK: That was a motion that was made in our last Engineering Services, but it has not been ratified by the full Commission. MR. MERRY: Okay. Because I know I've got two-hour parking signs -- I'm Bill Merry, I run Merry's Trash & Treasures on Broad Street. I've been there 34 years. We have two-hour parking signs in front of our building, in front my business. Are we to abide by them or not abide by them? I mean, I'm just a little -- you know, I want to make everybody happy. I own six pieces of property on Broad Street. I don't enjoy -- like my good friend, Mr. Julian Osbon, nobody's come out and asked me to move, you know, to Columbia, South Carolina. You know, I'm committed to Broad Street. I am locked into Broad Street. MR. HANDY: Okay. Well, I formed a committee. Mr. Patty is the chairman. And Mr. Patty is here, he's hearing your concern, and he will give you the answer; okay? Thank you. Yes, sir, Mr. Beard? MR. BEARD: I just wanted to ask if the merchants understood that if they wanted to work on this committee, that they could -- I think you mentioned that, but I want to make sure they understand it, that they could submit their name to Mr. Patty and be a part of that. Did I understand that correctly? MR. HANDY: You did. And, also -- MR. BEARD: Okay. I just wanted to make sure that they understood that. MR. HANDY: Also, whether it was clear or not, this is for downtown parking, period. Downtown parking. Okay? Thank y'all very much for coming, and we will try to get an answer to you real soon. Thank you. PUBLIC HEARING ADJOURNED AT 7:31 P.M. Lena J. Bonner Clerk of Commission-Council CERTIFICATION: I, Lena J. Bonner, Clerk of Commission-Council, hereby certify that the above is a true and correct copy of the Public Hearing held by Augusta-Richmond County Commission-Council on August 6, 1996. ______________________________ Clerk of Commission-Council C E R T I F I C A T E G E O R G I A RICHMOND COUNTY I, Cathy T. Pirtle, Certified Court Reporter, hereby certify that I reported the foregoing public hearing of the Augusta-Richmond County Commission-Council and supervised a true, accurate, and complete transcript of the proceedings as contained in the foregoing pages 1 through 51. I further certify that I am not a party to, related to, nor interested in the event or outcome of such proceedings. Witness my hand and official seal this 13th day of August 1996. ______________________________ CATHY T. PIRTLE, B-1763 CERTIFIED COURT REPORTER