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HomeMy WebLinkAboutCalled Commission Meeting November 9, 2021 CALLED MEETING COMMISSION CHAMBER November 9, 2021 Augusta Richmond County Commission convened at 11:00 a.m., Tuesday, November 9, 2021, the Honorable Hardie Davis, Jr., Mayor, presiding. PRESENT: Hons. Johnson, Garrett, Mason, Frantom, B. Williams, Scott, McKnight, D. Williams, Hasan and Clarke, members of Augusta Richmond County Commission. Mr. Mayor: The Chair recognizes Attorney Brown. Mr. Brown: Good afternoon, Mayor and Commissioners. We request a motion, did you want to handle the addendum? Mr. Mayor: We'll come back. Mr. Brown: All right. We request a motion to go into executive session for the discussion of personnel, litigation and real estate. Mr. Hasan: So move. Ms. Scott: Second. Mr. Mayor: Okay, after we vote then, let's just suspend for a minute. I need to ask a few questions. Some late arriving information just came to me. Everybody just suspend. Okay, all right, before we proceed, Madam Clerk, Attorney Brown, if we can just suspend on that vote. Attorney Brown, we're going to suspend on that just for now. There is on the special called meeting agenda one item and again as I understand it based on the information that I've received, we can take that matter up. We can take that matter up. Madam Clerk, we're going to go ahead and take that matter up. That's item number three on the special called meeting agenda. 3. Consider refund request in the amount of $2,170.00 ($310) since 2014 for Richmond County residents relative to non-solid waste pickups. (No recommendation from Engineering Services Committee October 26, 2021; referred from the Commission's November 2, 2021 meeting) Mr. Mayor: The Chair recognizes the Mayor Pro Tem. Mr. B. Williams: Motion to approve. Ms. McKnight: Second. Mr. Hasan: Mr. Mayor -- Mr. Mayor: I've got you, I've got you. 1 The Clerk: Okay, that was the Mayor Pro Tern approving that? Mr. Mayor: Right and the commissioner from the third second. All right, the Chair recognizes the commissioner from the 6th. Mr. Hasan: Mr. Mayor, the documentation that we have at best is $2100. The documentation that the Administrator sent us, I'm sorry, the department director sent us, is asking for three years. That is what the attorney is saying we can do by law so you can't give the $2100. But not only that the bigger issue, Mr. Mayor, there is no record that the City has that a request has ever been entered and ask to be exempt from two of these properties. There is no record of it and so really if the truth be told, I think it needs to be established here today before you make a motion to show why we are considering refunding the money. Mr. Mayor: Well - Mr. Hasan: Even three years. Mr. Mayor: Well, to the Chairman of Administrative Services we've had several weeks to establish that, we've had much debate about it, much conversation - Mr. Hasan: And you still don't have an, it's still not approved in case, that's what I'm asking for. Mr. Mayor: And as a result of that there was a package of information that was sent out that I'm aware of, sent out yesterday I believe, that hopefully addresses the remaining issues that we've talked about for several weeks now. So what I've not heard you do is have a substitute motion in support of this or that - Mr. Hasan: Because I want to hear what the Director is going to say first and then I'll make a motion from there. Mr. Mayor: Well, I'm prepared to go ahead and vote on it. Mr. Hasan: I'll make a substitute motion then. But I'd like to hear what the - Mr. Mayor: What's your substitute? Mr. Hasan: My substitute motion is to not make any, not to conduct business up until we hear what he has to say. Mr. Mayor: Well, that's not a motion. Mr. Hasan: I'm not going to make a motion to deny, Mr. Mayor, because there's no evidence, even the director is not asking to give us $2,100 and I'd like to see my colleague at least reconsider that until, because what he's asking is $900. He's not asking for these many years. By state statute we can only do three years but there is no evidence that we should refund any money 2 at this time. Mr. Mayor: All right, so are you suggesting that this - Mr. Hasan: Mr. Mayor, let the director speak. Mr. Mayor: I'm asking you - Mr. Hasan: No, let the director speak, Mr. Mayor, let the director speak. You're trying to avoid us having a conversation about something. Let the director speak. Director should speak because also, Mr. Mayor, the part about this in the book you've got on October 26 Commissioner Garrett put this on the agenda. Documentation that I have today shows that Mr. Stayer on the 19th of October and on the 22nd he had already sent it to the Tax Commissioner's Office to initiate a refund so that's premature to us even authorizing a refund so all this needs to be elaborated about, Mr. Mayor. We’re not at that point yet. Mr. Mayor: Here's what the Chairman knows that we've been debating this matter - Mr. Hasan: Mr. Mayor, it doesn't matter, it doesn't matter, don't matter how long we've been debating the issue. Mr. Mayor: I think it matters - Mr. Hasan: It doesn't matter, it doesn't matter - Mr. Mayor: I'm going to ask the commissioner from the 6th to suspend. Mr. Hasan: Mr. Mayor, I want to hear from the director. That's my ask, that's my first ask. Mr. Mayor: That's fine. Mr. Hasan: To hear from the director. Mr. Mayor: That's fine. All right, I'm going to ask the commissioner from the 6th to suspend. We have talked about this - Mr. Hasan: Mr. Mayor, no, no, I asked to hear, you acknowledged me. I'm asking to hear from the director. That's my ask. Mr. Mayor: And as I just said, I'm going to give you an opportunity to hear from the director. Mr. Hasan: Well, you don't have to try to massage it, Mr. Mayor. Let the director speak. Mr. Mayor: Okay, I'm going to call for the vote then since you won't suspend and yield. 3 I've been very respectful - Mr. Hasan: You have not. You have not. Mr. Mayor: Commissioner, as I've said \['m going to recognize - Mr. Hasan: You have not been respectful. The respectful part is to let the director speak. Let the director speak. That's what I asked for, you acknowledged me. My request is to let the director speak. That's my request. Mr. Mayor: Voting. Mr. Hasan: You acknowledged me. I make a substitute motion. I make a substitute motion Mr. Mayor: As I said I'm going to, I've given you ample opportunity to let me conduct this meeting and you refuse to do that. Mr. Hasan: (inaudible). Mr. Mayor: Okay, well, then suspend. Suspend. Suspend. That's all I asked you to do. Now I'm going to repeat what I was about to say. Director Stayer has asked, been asked to speak. We also asked for them to provide us with this information. I remember it vividly. That was the conversation last week and here it is we find ourselves with all of these questions that were supposed to have been answered for us. That was supposed to have been answered for us primarily at the request of the commissioner from the 66. And now we come to this meeting today and we still don't have the answers. There's something fundamentally and structurally wrong with that when we're having this conversation today at your request. Director Stayer. There's something fundamentally wrong, commissioner from the 6ft. We're having this conversation at your request and we still don't have answers. Director Stayer, please proceed. Mr. Stayer: Brooks Stayer, Environmental Services Director. So I think the first question is on the documentation from the customer and so what we researched was that prior to 2014 the transition to the Elemos system database and the once-a-week automated collection, they were exempt and then from 2014 that transition you know that there were hundreds of properties that did not make that migration in data and we had to grant exemptions back to. So we do not have the actual form they requested from 2013 because we only hold onto records according to the county policy for three years. But every indication we have is that they filed the exemption, the exemption was approved and they were not paying taxes on the property and so by all accounts, they did file the proper paperwork and they were exempt and should not have paid taxes. Mr. Mayor: Continue. Commissioner, you have the floor. Would you push your button so we can hear you, sir? Mr. Hasan: I'm sorry. Can you hear me now? I thought it was on. Mr. Mayor: You've been on. 4 Mr. Hasan: What are you recommending in terms of refunding them? Mr. Stayer: We follow the Georgia Tax Code of three years. Mr. Hasan: Okay. Mr. Stayer: We don't officially have that as a policy. What happened was in 2014 we anticipated not having this problem that all the customers who had exemptions would continue to have exemptions but again in that migration of data hundreds of them were lost and so the first year we gave back everybody who asked. The second year we gave everybody who asked but they asked for a second year and the third year they asked for a third year so we capped it at three years and that's my understanding because we've only had seven requests including these two in the last four years so this is not common. Most of the people have been corrected, there are very few erroneous billings left as far as we know so we've done the three year based on Georgia tax code but that's not been approved by the Commission. Mr. Hasan: Okay, but if that's what you just said what you've just said why in October 19 and October the 22nd you asked for three years refund for them and this conversation started October 26. Mr. Stayer: Because that is the policy I inherited that we've been following for seven years. Mr. Hasan: So why wouldn't you acknowledge that to let us, inform us that you had already initiated a refund to them because when you called me the other day you said, what you're pretty much saying is that you only saw one address, it might have been A, that had an exemption. That's the only one you know of. You never mentioned that even though the other two that you've already initiated refunding them three years each. You never said that. Mr. Stayer: I apologize if I didn't say it. It is in the documentation I provided. Mr. Hasan: Is in the documentation you provided. Mr. Stayer: That's the reason you're hearing about it today is because we informed the customers we would follow our procedure of going back three years and they said they asked for all seven and so they brought it to the Commission. Mr. Hasan: I have one more question, Mr. Mayor, and I'm going to make a substitute motion. Mr. Stayer, do you realize the documentation that you sent us you didn't put the procedure in it and what the procedure says that no prior periods request will be granted meaning that they have to apply again on an annual basis that your department, your current department, sends a list to the Tax Commissioner office of who is to be charged solid waste and neither one of those addresses, both of those addresses was on it, even in '14. A was not, those other two was and that's why they were continuously being charged solid waste fees as early as'14. There is no indication from your department that an ask was ever entered and just because they was not 5 charged previous years you had to ask in'13 to start the process in'14. That's not an automatic process. Mr. Mayor, I'm not going to debate this. I think my colleagues are ready to do this instead of them doing something wrong. I'd like to make a motion here. My motion is, substitute motion - Mr. Mayor: Continue. Mr. Hasan: Substitute motion is to give them the three years, if that's what you want to do, but however put a moratorium on exempting anybody else until we can get a policy in that's going to protect the government of how these citizens are going to dispose of their waste. There should be a policy in place, allow the Administrator and allow the attorney to come back and to look at that, a policy in place and bring back a policy but also look at the authority that comes with this particular issue in that department because there's too much authority for the director so that we can make informed decisions moving forward. That's my motion. Mr. Mason: What's the motion? Mr. Hasan: My motion is a substitute motion, Commissioner, and it's not because what we're going to lose is (inaudible) they're going to (inaudible) $2100 and he's not even asking for that. Mr. Mason: There's a lot being said. I was just trying to make sure I was clear. I'll second for the purposes of having a second but I wanted to - Mr. Hasan: Mr. Mayor, let me ask the General Counsel something. Can I make two motions? Mr. Mayor: No. You cannot. You cannot. You can make a substitute motion and if it gets a proper second then we have an opportunity to vote it up or down. Mr. Hasan: Mr. Mason, I'll wait on you then. Go ahead. I'll wait before I make a motion. Mr. Mayor: No, sir. Mr. Hasan: I don't have to make a motion, Mr. Mayor, since you said - Mr. Mayor: No, you just said you made a substitute motion. The commissioner from the 4th said for the purposes of extending the debate he would second it for your purposes. Mr. Hasan: Okay, okay. Mr. Mayor: There is a lot of passion in the room. It's not necessary. We've having a conversation, commissioner from the 6th, because you've asked for it for four weeks – 6 Mr. Hasan: Mr. Mayor, because you - Mr. Mayor: -- so now that we're here the commissioner from the 4th you get recognized. Mr. Mason: Yes, thank you, Mr. Mayor. Just a couple of things. One, for the director, I've heard what you said and I think I understand what you're saying so from your standpoint the $2170 that we're looking at here is really not in question. That is something that could be given. Okay, so and then, Mr. Mayor, from the parliamentarian just to make sure that we're clear because I heard something about a three-year deal, are we in any legal jeopardy, are we okay with doing what we're doing if we do this 2100 here? Mr. Brown: No, sir, that would be veering away from policy - Mr. Mason: No? Now, wait a minute. Mr. Brown: No, sir. That would be veering away, that represents seven years. Mr. Mason: So you wouldn't recommend that? Mr. Brown: No, I do not. Mr. Mayor: If I heard the director correctly, what he said is pursuant to policy, pursuant to the loss of paperwork between 2013 and2014 is that he's communicated to the petitioner that they're eligible for three years. I just heard him say that. And they have come forward just to inquire the Commission about seven but he communicated to them that they're only allowed three years. He just said that. He just said that. Mr. Mason: Okay, so we're voting on the three years then? Mr. Mayor: Yes, we're voting on three years. Mr. Mason: Okay. Mr. Garrett: The original motion is for the full seven. Mr. Mayor: I understand that as well. Mr. Garrett: Okay. Mr. Mayor: Let me clarify to the commissioner from the 4th. Might I suggest the following? Help the commissioner from the 6th by friendly inquiring that he amend the substitute to simply say that motion, substitute motion to approve a three-year refund, period. Mr. Mason: I would ask the commissioner from the 6th to put that in the form of a substitute motion. I think that kind of clears it up a little bit based on what we've heard from our parliamentarian as well. We will address the other issues - 7 Mr. Hasan: I will make a substitute motion to refund the three years. Mr. Mason: Second. Mr. Mayor: Thank you. The Chairman of Engineering Services. I'll give you an opportunity to speak. Mr. Garrett: Thank you, Mayor. I believe you also heard the Director from Environmental Services say that it was Augusta's fault that they were charged for this full seven years and I think that is why this is before this Commission today. During the switch over to the new system the previous exemption did not make it into the new system so they've been charged for something they have never, ever received and that's why I brought this to the Commission even though it is outside of the policy that Augusta does not have. They're going by the state policy. There is leeway for the Commission to do the right thing here and to refund all of the money that they have been charged and paid for the last seven years. That is why this is before us. The three years never even had to come before the Commission. The Director could have done that himself. But the fact that the paperwork that was sent out that clearly shows the timeline including the property that was in question last week never paid and so that is not even part of this. There's only two properties included in this, the Barnes and the Fullers, and that's why the first motion should stick. Mr. Mayor: All right, again, let's just do this. The commissioner from the 8th, the Chairman of Engineering Services, is correct on all points. That is true. The matter that's being brought before us again, the underlying motion was a full refund request pursuant to the challenges of the system and all things being said. You've got a substitute motion and General Counsel, again, out of an abundance of caution has suggested that you approve what the substitute motion calls for. But without question the Chairman of Engineering Services is accurate, completely accurate. Mr. Hasan: Not true, Mr. Mayor. Mr. Mayor: Voting. You're voting on the substitute. Mr. McKnight, Mr. Frantom, Mr. Garrett and Mr. Clarke voting No. Motion carries 6-4. Mr. Mayor: Thank you, Madam Clerk. Mr. Garrett: Point of personal privilege, Mayor. Mr. Mayor: State your inquiry. Mr. Garrett: Thank you. So once again we're not going to do the right thing to our constituents and refund the money that is due to them and this bothers me tremendously. It bothers me that our attorney has spoken to a policy that doesn't exist except at the state level. It's even stated that the policy was never adopted by the Commission. He also did not expound that we had the authority to go outside of said policy. 8 Mr. Mayor: Thank you. The Chair recognizes the General Counsel. Mr. Brown: Yes, commissioner, Mayor, statement by Commissioner Garrett is not accurate as to what General Counsel has done or said. What I said was that state law provides three years. This policy, the director is also incorrect but he being new may be a misunderstanding. This Commission gave the authority to Environmental Service Director to establish the policy. Environmental Services Director established a policy of three years max. That has been the policy of Environmental Services for several years. In addition, what state law says any government, city or county government, that has a waste collection service has the same powers and authority as the state has in collecting taxes and fees which will include refunds. The power that the state gives to the county is three years max. If you go beyond three years max, you're waiving your sovereign immunity against claims for all your citizens. So the City can waive its sovereign immunity. If you go beyond the three years, you would have set a precedent and you would have no ability to distinguish between any other claimants who could have come before the Commission and requested within three years a claim. Mr. Garrett: So this is the fourth week we have discussed this. Last week you said we could go as far as four years so which week are we supposed to listen to you as being right? Mr. Brown: Yes, I would like to respond. Mr. Mayor: I want you to. Mr. Brown: Yes. Last week I stated that the most because of the matter should not have been voted on last week, it was not attempted to be voted on last week but the commissioner from the 8ft put a motion on the floor when the Commission prior instructions was simply for Environmental Services and the Law Department to go back and find out what was the policy or was there a policy - Mr. Garrett: No, the direction was to find the documentation referring to these two properties. Mr. Brown: And the other part was to see if there actually was an application for exemption. That was what was supposed to be brought back last week. The documentation did not come forth from Environmental Services. Along with the help of the Clerk, I did find the policies that were adopted and that were published by Environmental Services, it was in your agenda book last week. It's in your agenda book today. So that was brought back. At the time when the motion was made for $2100 which represented seven years, it was my obligation at that point to alert the Commission there's a statute of limitation and I said at the time based upon the research we had it certainly does not exceed four years. This week Environmental Services Director and their department did research to show what their practice had been and they brought forth in the memorandum yesterday telling you when the person applied, what they believed had happened, how the mistake occurred, etc. so that was the facts. At that point it became clear since Environmental Services which the Commission had authorized to establish a policy they had previously decided before this director that the maximum would be three years. 9 Mr. Garrett: Attorney, if you had paid seven years - Mr. Mayor: Hold on, hold on. Commissioner, suspend. Mr. Brown: The only authority that the City has in terms of sovereign immunity is given by the state. The City has no authority to waive its sovereign immunity, but the state has allowed a waiver of sovereign immunity against the City for claims regarding refunds for fees up to three years so you need a legal basis, you need a legal basis to go beyond those three years. Mr. Garrett: Is not the legal basis the paperwork? Mr. Mayor: All right, Commissioner, suspend, suspend. We've had a motion, we've had a vote to support what current policy is. What General Counsel has done and I'm fully aware of, all of us are aware of it, we've been debating this matter again for four weeks. There have been saliant points raised by the commissioner from the 8ff, the commissioner from the 6th, both who serve on Engineering Services as Chair and Vice Chair. And yet we're still having a conversation that you all could have had the answers to. The commissioner from the 6th just indicated he's had separate conversations, this matter is done, it's over with, we voted on it. Madam Clerk, there's another matter, the Mayor Pro Tem. The Chair recognizes the Mayor Pro Tem. Mr. B. Williams: Yes, sir. I'd like to place on the agenda a Resolution for the death of Reverend Hatney. Ms. Bonner, you have that? Mr. Mayor: Without objection. The Clerk: Okay, so it is to be added without objection. Mr. Mayor: Without objection. (Voice in background) Mr. Mayor: No, ma'am. This matter, I want to hear from you but there's a lot of passion. You've been granted, ma'am, ma'am, I appreciate it. Thank you. The Clerk: Therefore, be it resolved with a sincere (inaudible). The resolution of condolences for the Rev. Dr. Johnny R. Hatney. Therefore, be it resolved that it is with our sincere care and concern that we the Augusta, Georgia Commission send these humble words expressing our heartfelt sympathy. May you find comfort in knowing that others care and share your loss. It be further resolved that a copy of this resolution be forwarded to the family and friends of Rev. Dr. Johnny R. Hatney this 9th day of November in the year of our Lord 202l. Mr. Mayor: Mayor Pro Tem. Mr. B. Williams: So move. Mr. Hasan: Second. 10 Mr. Mayor: Okay. Voting. Motion carries 10-0. Mr. Mayor: Thank you, Madam Clerk. I'm going to say this. You know we live in a community, we live in a world that becomes increasingly more and more polarized. Matters like what we have been debating for four weeks now all they take is a simple phone call, a series of conversations with the appropriate principals to one, first get understanding. I'm reminded in scripture where we're reminded that wisdom is the chief thing but get understanding. Get understanding. And all to often we find ourselves at a place where we're fixated on having our voice and our position heard without getting understanding. It then tums into passionate debates like we have today much of which is relegated to the lack of understanding about what is and what isn't right. When we end up voting on matters and having discussion about it, it turns into a colorful conversation. The media is going to say when you had six black votes for it and four white votes against it, it's time out. We're much better than that. If all we do is take a moment again to have the conversation. I'm not interested in filibustering to hold a position but what I am interested in is tamping down on the back and forth, back and forth particularly when we've had this discussion and when there's a lack of understanding. Hit the pause button just long enough to just understand. How do we get here, how do we resolve it and how do we have long-term solutions that make our city better and make our community better so that we're not hovering around this notion of fighting amongst ourselves. It's just not necessary. So at the end of the day wisdom is the chief thing but in all of our getting, get an understanding. Proverbs 4 and 7 . Let the day be a getting an understanding of what we're trying to get done, how best to get it done and then leverage the people resources that we have to do it. We'll retire to the room 291. The Clerk: We need to take a vote, sir. Mr. Mayor: Okay, all right. Attorney Brown, I'm going to come back to you. 1. LEGAL MEETING A. Pending and potential litigation B. Real estate C. Personnel Mr. Brown: We request a motion, Mayor and Commissioners, to go into executive session for the discussion, possible discussion of personnel, real estate and pending or potential litigation. Mr. Hasan: So move. Mr. D. Williams: Second. Mr. Mayor: Voting. Motion carries 10-0. 11 \[EXECUTIVE SESSION\] Mr. Mayor: We'll reconvene and call this meeting back to order. The Chair recognizes Attorney Brown. 2. Motion to authorize execution by the Mayor of the affidavit of compliance with Georgia's Open Meeting Act. Mr. Brown: Mayor and Commissioners, we request a motion to execute the closed meeting affidavit. Mr. Frantom: So moved. Mr. Hasan: Second. Mr. Mayor: Voting. Motion carries 10-0. Mr. Mayor: The Chair recognizes Attorney Brown for the reading of a motion. Mr. Brown: Our first motion, Mayor Davis, would be a motion to approve additional, purchasing of additional software in an amount up to $691000. Mr. Frantom: So moved. Mr. Hasan: Second. Mr. Mayor: Voting. Motion carries 10-0. Mr. Mayor: The Chair recognizes Attorney Brown for the reading of a motion. Mr. Brown: Motion to approve a settlement and a payment in the amount of $28,173.83 to Janet Rockefeller in settlement of an automobile collision property claim which occurred on September 27, 2021. Mr. Frantom: So move. Mr. Hasan: Second. Mr. Mayor: The Chair recognizes the commissioner from the 6ft. State your inquiry. 12 Mr. Hasan: I wanted to ask the attorney should that be in the name of the institution or the individual? Mr. Brown: Let me modify the motion to say that the $28,173.83 will be paid in settlement of a claim with Janet Rockefeller to the appropriate parties in connection with the damaged automobile. Mr. Mayor: Okay. Voting. Motion carries 10-0. Mr. Mayor: The Chair recognizes Attorney Brown for the reading of a motion. Mr. Brown: A motion to approve the acceptance of the resignation of Robert Sherman as Planning Director effective end of day December 31, 2020 (sic) and to approve - Mr. Mayor: 2021. Mr. Brown: 2021 and to approve a severance payment of three months’ salary continuation pursuant to the Augusta SES policy subject to Mr. Sherman entering into a severance and settlement agreement with Augusta as prepared by the Augusta Law Department. Ms. McKnight: So move. Mr. Hasan: Second. Mr. Mayor: Voting. Motion carries 10-0. Mr. Brown: There are no further motions. Mr. Mayor: Thank you. Madam Clerk, I believe that that concludes our special called meeting. The Clerk: Yes, sir. Mr. Mayor: Thank you. \[MEETING ADJOURNED\] Lena J. Bonner Clerk of Commission 13 CERTIFICATION: I, Lena J. Bonner, Clerk of Commission, hereby certify that the above is a true and correct copy of the minutes of the Called Meeting of the Augusta Richmond County Commission held on November 9, 2021. _______________________________ Clerk of Commission 14